XT6 won't start sometimes

Forum for Subaru XT and/or XT6 owners

Moderators: Hocrest, Myxalplyx, Huck369, Moodybluesr, grossgary, john in KY, SUBBYRU89, austinXT6

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby Huck369 on Wed Jun 08, 2011 8:26 pm

Replace the Ground wire from the battery to the starter/bell housing bolt, make sure the contact area is clean..
Huck
Subaru Ambassador
88 XT6 5-Speed(Project Car)
08 Impreza 2.5I 5-Speed
92 SVX LS-Tour (Yellow AWD 5-Speed)
09 Forester X Premium
The Creator of FrankenWedge
User avatar
Huck369
Moderator
 
Posts: 15544
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2002 9:34 am
Location: Somerset, KY

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:04 pm

Huck369 wrote:Replace the Ground wire from the battery to the starter/bell housing bolt, make sure the contact area is clean..
will do. should be able to run a heavy gauge wire from negative battery terminal to the starter ground as a test, right? then if that fixes it, i'll replace the wire?

thanks huck, will do when i get back in a week and a half.
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby kingbobdole on Thu Jun 09, 2011 2:08 am

Have you done the voltage drop test?
~Phil
EZ Cheeze
FWD magic SVX
Fe Coupe
Rust in the shape of a BRAT
Alfa Romeo GTV
Motorless Impreza sport
TURBO! bike
Da Rune

SubaruJawn wrote:Does yellow really do that ?

subeman90 wrote:LeBaron.

austinXT6 wrote: It's a little doo-dad that sticks up an inch or so
User avatar
kingbobdole
Cheesy monarch
 
Posts: 6607
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2004 3:47 am
Location: Way to close to Jeff

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Thu Jun 09, 2011 4:17 am

kingbobdole wrote:Have you done the voltage drop test?
meter, and another i borrowed, are MIA. i know they're there somewhere, just can't find them. :roll:

out of town for a week and a half, will try all these things when i get back. want to be driving it again.
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 am

ironhydroxide wrote:I would say test voltage AT THE STARTER, While Cranking...if it is low.... (8 or less) then check at the battery while cranking, if the battery stays above 10 then the wire is BAD... REPLACE BOTH


while trying to crank the voltages were about (hard to see with needle bouncing):
at starter solenoid: about 7 or 8 volts
at spade connector: about 8 volts

for comparison my legacy has 12 volts and drops to 10.5 volts while cranking, very small drop.

starter voltage is fine while *NOT* cranking, so the wire to the solenoid might not be the problem?

so it seems like the XT6 voltages are too low.....but still not sure what to do next:

1. run a heavy gauge wire from positive terminal to starter solenoid?
2. run a heavier gauge wire from _____? to the starter spade terminal? can't do positive as that will engage it every time. 3. remove space terminal and have it activate a relay which provides heavier gauge wire from positive battery to spade terminal?


i guess my question is whether it's the wiring from battery to starter solenoid or the spade terminal wiring?
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby ironhydroxide on Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:00 am

From the battery terminal to the positive on the starter.. JUST REPLACE IT.. it is probably old enough that water has seeped into the insulator and oxidized the wiring.

if you really want to go with a larger wire/smaller gauge.. then go ahead.

and if you plan on doing a relay, (the solenoid is pretty much a relay) then take the wire to the spade, wire it to either the 86 pole or the 85 pole, with the other (86 or 85) wired to ground. then take the 30 pole and run a wire from the positive side of the starter, then take the 87 and wire it to the spade on the solenoid.

this will give you a double relay, IN CASE the switch isn't giving enough voltage/amperage to pull the solenoid in place.
If the tires don't scream, You aint goin' fast enough!!

my baby SVXT6 pearly

xt6 5spd red Parts car

Honda FT500 Ascott Motorcycle Red
User avatar
ironhydroxide
Veteran
 
Posts: 1239
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 8:52 pm
Location: Wellsville Utah, (near logan)

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:41 am

awesome, thanks beast.

? so the ignition shouldn't *be able* to affect the low voltage while cranking, it's probably the wiring?

ironhydroxide wrote:From the battery terminal to the positive on the starter.. JUST REPLACE IT.. it is probably old
cool, i can try something like this today. you think this is most likely? engine/wiring is all really clean looking, but that obviously doesn't mean anything. i'll run a heavy gauge wire right to the starter as a test.

ironhydroxide wrote:and if you plan on doing a relay, (the solenoid is pretty much a relay) then take the wire to the spade, wire it to either the 86 pole or the 85 pole, with the other (86 or 85) wired to ground. then take the 30 pole and run a wire from the positive side of the starter, then take the 87 and wire it to the spade on the solenoid.
ah! no clue what these numbers/poles mean? i assume you're talking about a specific connector in the engine bay or something?
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby ironhydroxide on Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:01 pm

i'm talking about these numbered poles Image
If the tires don't scream, You aint goin' fast enough!!

my baby SVXT6 pearly

xt6 5spd red Parts car

Honda FT500 Ascott Motorcycle Red
User avatar
ironhydroxide
Veteran
 
Posts: 1239
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 8:52 pm
Location: Wellsville Utah, (near logan)

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:59 pm

okay - that's just standard relay numbering, nothing subaru or XT6 specific?

This is getting worse - I tried 10 things and nothing worked. I don't want to replace all the wiring, the ignition...and that not fix the problem so I'd like to diagnose something.

Ran heavy gauge wire to the starter solenoid (+), the spade connector (+) and to ground (-) ......no change at all when starting - identical symptoms every time.

Doesn't this suggest that replacing all the wiring isn't going to help?

*** I removed all the spark plugs and the engine would turn over continuously just fine....it wouldn't "stop" like it did previously. I assume just because it's much less load on the starter/circuit. This suggests the ignition is fine since that should be an identical load for it, i think?

No wetness on spark plugs or compression tester when i tested compression so I assume this isn't hydrolock.

I'm really scratching my head now.
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby ironhydroxide on Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:23 pm

have you tried a different starter... it is starting to sound like one of the windings has lost its smoke....
If the tires don't scream, You aint goin' fast enough!!

my baby SVXT6 pearly

xt6 5spd red Parts car

Honda FT500 Ascott Motorcycle Red
User avatar
ironhydroxide
Veteran
 
Posts: 1239
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 8:52 pm
Location: Wellsville Utah, (near logan)

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:44 pm

ironhydroxide wrote:have you tried a different starter... it is starting to sound like one of the windings has lost its smoke....
first thing i did was to install a new rebuilt starter (and solenoid) and the symptoms were identical - no change at all. if it was a bad starter i wouldn't expect the exact same symptoms on two starters.
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby Myxalplyx on Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:26 pm

Gary,

Have you ever resolved this issue? My problem doesn't seem to be the same as yours. I simply have the ..turn the ignition and click, ....turn off and back on...click. Keep doing this until eventually starts up. Been like this for some 8-10yrs. I did change the starter about 2yrs ago but hardly drove the car since. Maybe 1500 miles. About to tackle the issue this winter though. Planning on replacing the wires.

May as well get the little issues fixed/repaired since the car runs great overall.
Kevin Thomas
1989 2.7ltr XT6 AWD/Auto *WndCttr*
JC Sports Intake, Rallispec Header, Custom 2.5" exhaust with 2.5" Magnaflow muffler
Advanced Timing 32 degrees
ProECM Lightweight pulley
4.44 gears, LSD
User avatar
Myxalplyx
Moderator
 
Posts: 2763
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2002 8:55 pm
Location: New Castle, DE

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby john in KY on Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:50 pm

Install 4-pole relay under the hood. The individual relay terminals are numbered. Can't recall at the moment but easy found on the internet. One side of the relay is the "switch" side. just closes the internal contact that allows current from another source, the battery, to flow through the relay. Connect the original solenoid wire to one of the "switch" terminals. Really makes no difference if you swap them. Ground the other terminal.

The remaining 2 terminals. Hot wire from the battery and another wire to the solenoid.

Now when you turn the key, the relay is "closed" and a full 12 volts with plenty of amps flows to the solenoid.

Solves the problem every time.


4 Pole Relay Switch Wiring Diagrams - Wiring Diagrams

Obviously didn't read all the old posts before posting this.
john in KY
Moderator
 
Posts: 3156
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2002 8:12 pm
Location: KY

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:33 pm

Myxalplyx wrote:My problem doesn't seem to be the same as yours. I simply have the ..turn the ignition and click, ....turn off and back on...click. Keep doing this until eventually starts up.
this is usually caused by the starter contacts, very common wear items. They're cheap and easy to replace, I just did my outback last year.

This is the correct kit for an automatic Outback. I don't know how to find out what the XT6 needs but since I want to do this to my automatic as well I can find out.

Here's the kit for the outback automatic, you end up using two of the copper contacts, not all 4, and the plunger:
https://smile.amazon.com/Victory-Lap-ND ... op?ie=UTF8

you replace the two copper contacts and the plunger, ignore the other stuff in the photo here:
https://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic ... 19&t=41495
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

Re: XT6 won't start sometimes

Postby grossgary on Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:41 pm

Myxalplyx wrote:Gary,

Have you ever resolved this issue?
It went away but i don't recall why/how. This happened right after I got the car shipped from california so it had sat for some extended periods and I'm wondering if it wasn't just corrosion/terminals/battery because I never had those issues again and don't recall doing anything except maybe installing a new starter i already had on hand.
Gary
89 XT6, rear LSD
02 OBW VDC H6
06 Tribeca
grossgary
Moderator
 
Posts: 11634
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:34 pm
Location: midatlantic

PreviousNext

Return to Subaru XT discussions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests

cron