MY 87 VORTEX

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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby Johnny T on Thu Nov 08, 2018 7:28 pm

Hi guys

Just an update, I have been issues fitting the front XT6 brakes with the drive shaft as the XT4 Spline is too large to fit through the center of the discs. Is there any chance I can use another model drive shaft or will I have to get it custom made?
1987 Subaru Vortex XT Turbo 4wd 88kw of FUN!
Custom black interior and a now running ea82t engine, new front lip spoiler, rear spoiler, XT6 Hubs
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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby john in KY on Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:04 pm

Can you post a photo or two? Not clear what combination of parts you now have. Are you using XT6 CV axles or the XT axles? Thinking if you are using XT6 hubs, CV axles from a Legacy can be made to work. Something about the inner grease seal is different but a certain grease seal can solve that problem. Another member, thinking Numbchux or something like that came up with a combination that works.
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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby Johnny T on Sun Nov 11, 2018 3:31 pm

Thanks John, I am using the XT6 hubs and only have the XT4 drive shafts, I can go to my local wrecker and get a set of 99 Liberty shafts, assuming that the Liberty and Legacy are the same?
My mechanic said there should be a way to use the outer to make it all work.

Thanks again for the advice :)
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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby john in KY on Sun Nov 11, 2018 5:28 pm

For some reason I am thinking CV axles for a FWD 1st generation Impreza works.

Send numbchux, a long time member, an email. Describe the problem and even money says he will have the answer.


Found this in a search for "FWD CV axles"

EJ front driveshafts in XT
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EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby Bram_R on 17 Jan 2015 18:06

as long as I had my EJ-XT running, I heard some kind of scraping undefined sound when I rode over small bumps in the road.

For those not completely familiar with my build:
1986 XT Turbo, with 1998 Legacy Turbo EJ20 turbo engine with matching 5speed tranny in there.
Legacy Turbo front knuckles on the standard front suspensions arms (suspension arm modified for the larger EJ lower ball joint).
For suspension, got the 2008 STi coil overs on there.

I never was exactly sure if the EJ front driveshaft were too long for the XT application, so that during suspension compression that CV joints in the driveshaft were stressing or that the shafts were pushing to hard against the transmission.

So, to test this I did the following:

- removed spring from shock absorber
- disconnected front sway bar

This way I can raise and lower the knuckle with no resistance from the spring or the sway bar.
Using a jack and a piece of wood, I jacked up the suspension arm until the driveshaft was in the horizontal position (shortest distance tranny to hub).

Now, being this position, I measured about a 6mm play by grabbing the driveshaft and slinding it towards and from the tranny.
Seems like enough play in the driveshaft splines.

I did notice I didn't had the cotter pin on the transmission side of the driveshaft, don't know if that causes some things on the driveshaft upon compression...

Spring removed, sway bar disconnected, jacked up knuckle up to horizontal position of driveshaft:
Image

Driveshaft can move about 6mm back and forth in this position:
Image

I have the thick '3 groove' driveshaft, the ones with the one groove are thinner and come from 1.8 Legacy's or something.
Image

Detail grooves:
Image

gr. Bram
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// Project EJ-XT http://www.subaruxt.com/forum/viewtopic ... 93&start=0 //
// 5-lug swap by http://www.crossbreadperformance.com //
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby racevortex87 on 24 Feb 2015 04:50

should pm fury ( chris ) think he has ej front shafts in his, i unfortunately am no help as my front shafts are invisible hehe but its soo funn!!!!
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby Caboobaroo on 24 Feb 2015 16:09

I've had a pair of first gen Legacy axles in my XT6 for two years with no issues.
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby Numbchux on 25 Feb 2015 20:52

Yep, I've used the same pair of '92 Legacy FWD 4EAT axles/knuckles in 3 EA cars now....no issues to report.
'89 XT6, 4EAT AWD
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby kingbobdole on 27 Feb 2015 11:38

I've got them in both of mine. One has legacy hubs the other is stock. No issues.
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby Bram_R on 08 Mar 2015 15:34

Thanks guys, I kind of knew it wasn't an issue because of other project I knew about, but now it should be definite for generations to come, all EJ driveshafts fit the Leone II drivetrain with no problems, with or without EJ knuckles.

gr. bram

Now that I put in the cotter pins in the driveshaft on the transmission side, maybe the sound is gone too. But I won't know that until I got all that rust repaired...
Sorrow Six Star wrote:
Bram has what we call an "insane build" don't let that scare you off.

// Project EJ-XT http://www.subaruxt.com/forum/viewtopic ... 93&start=0 //
// 5-lug swap by http://www.crossbreadperformance.com //
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby grossgary on 09 Mar 2015 13:24

So what's the end formula here?

1990-1994 EJ axles will fit XT6 hubs with no modifications? (except the oddball 1993 impreza FWD with a different spline count).

what about 1995 EJ axles?
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby Numbchux on 09 Mar 2015 22:53

'93-'94 FWD 5MT imprezas have the 23-spline inners.

GD imprezas ('02-'07 sedans) have a wider track width, and therefore longer axles. Those will probably bottom out. Somewhere around '06, they began switching to male splines on the axle inners, instead of female.

So basically almost any EJ axle up until '01, and a few beyond that are what we're talking about. I do believe that the FWD Legacy ones are slightly shorter, and so are a better fit, but the others have been used with very rare problems.



There are 2 problems when it comes to mixing EJ axles with ER knuckles.

1st is the inner bearing seal. The EJ and ER setups use completely different inner seals (both ID and OD are larger on the ERs). An EJ axle will not seal the wheel bearing properly. I found some part numbers for some conversion seals a few years ago, and even test-fitted them. But have never run them.

2nd is the physical shape of the EJ knuckle. The overall shape of the knuckle is slightly different, placing the bearing slightly further out relative the ball joint and strut mounting tab. The hub offset is slightly different, almost completely canceling this out as far as the scrub radius is concerned. But this may cause an issue with axle length. It's a small difference, but with an AWD axle shaft, you're already close to bottoming out the DOJ, depending on your ride height, it might just be enough.


I have never bothered trying to make the XT6 knuckles work. The EJ ones are so readily available, so easy to retrofit, and offer numerous improvements (geometry, specifically the tabs that the TREs attach to are a different angle, shortening the effective tie rod length, which improves the Akerman angle, but also camber and brake options).
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'84 Brat, 4" Lift
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby grossgary on 10 Mar 2015 06:21

copy, that's what i'm confused about - phil says he used them in an XT6 knuckle?
the xt6 outer part of the axle has a concave like tapered shape and the EJ axles are flush/straight, i wasn't picturing how that would work.
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby crazyhorse_001 on 12 Mar 2015 14:31

I also have ej axles in my stock er knuckles. I have a mystery vibration but new axles didnt change that, so i can rule them out
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby Numbchux on 12 Mar 2015 19:37

crazyhorse_001 wrote:
I also have ej axles in my stock er knuckles. I have a mystery vibration but new axles didnt change that, so i can rule them out


What did you do about the inner bearing seal issue?
'89 XT6, 4EAT AWD
'84 Brat, 4" Lift
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'91 Toyota Celica GT...Poly Bushings, brake upgrades, DD
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby crazyhorse_001 on 13 Mar 2015 10:38

I didnt know there was one, so im guessing thats why i need bearings now lol
Nought but by the grace of God
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby john in KY on 13 Mar 2015 18:05

You can have the nonXT6 axles turned down .020 and retain the XT6 hubs.
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Re: EJ front driveshafts in XT
Postby kingbobdole on 16 Apr 2015 22:51

I was in a pinch so I just yanked the inner seal. It's a new bearing so maybe it'll last? :lol:
~Phil
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Fe Coupe
Rust in the shape of a BRAT
Alfa Romeo GTV
Motorless Impreza sport
TURBO! bike
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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby Johnny T on Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:36 pm

Hi all

Just a small update. The car is almost ready to get the bay painted and when it comes back I'll be putting the engine back in after it gets a full service and change all the gaskets and pump etc..

I have been looking at some wheels and found a set of BBS wheels, but would like to know if it is what 19" wheels will fit without any issues. My options are:
19x8.5
19x9
19x9.5
19x10
19x11
19x12

Any advise will be very helpfull :)
1987 Subaru Vortex XT Turbo 4wd 88kw of FUN!
Custom black interior and a now running ea82t engine, new front lip spoiler, rear spoiler, XT6 Hubs
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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby Huck369 on Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:58 pm

Phil has 17"'s on the CheeZe Wedge but I don't think 19 will fit, as the 17's are a pretty tight fit....
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Re: MY 87 VORTEX

Postby Johnny T on Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:54 pm

Thanks Huck,

That's one thing I need to avoid, no point putting on wheels that wont fit hahahha (talk about throwing money away)

I found this on a Japanese Website (not sure if its airbags)
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1987 Subaru Vortex XT Turbo 4wd 88kw of FUN!
Custom black interior and a now running ea82t engine, new front lip spoiler, rear spoiler, XT6 Hubs
Image
Johnny T
 
Posts: 223
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:10 pm
Location: Australia Melbourne

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